I think we touched on this topic before, but I was looking at some of Jerry Kerr's photographs that he has posted. I love the picture and I am so gald he is doing what he loves. It got me to thinking about how I chose my profession of nursing. I am grateful to be a nurse, but I chose that major because I had changed by major many times and my parents just wanted be to graduate.
I started as a Veterinarian major and changed becasue I let the macho men in Texas influence. I started a few others, then decided on teaching. About that time there were not many teaching jobs available. My friend Vicki Smith was going to be a nurse, so I decided to do that, too.
I wish I had perservered with veterinary medicine. I wish I had perservered with training horses. I wish I had perservered with dancing. I let my parents and others influence me and I submitted to their ideas.
Of course I have hobbies that include these interests and my career as a nurse has been rewarding. I am very happy for people, such as Jerry Kerr with his airforce pilot career and now his Civil Air Patrol career, Peter Shelton with his internally known art career, Ricky Evans with his farming, Greg Campbell with his bowls...I know there are more. Diane Hull-Grant became the Nurse, mother and wife of Eddie Grant, all of which she had and still has a passion.
I would like to hear from others about their passions and derailed careers.
I've had a pretty successful career as a mechanical design engineer, but I've never ever been passionate about it. Not even an eensy weensy bit. Without a big explanation of why I didn't choose something other, here's the list of careers I maybe should've considered:
psychologist
pastor
industrial designer (the people who make products look cool)
architect
children's book illustrator
artist
humorist (like Dave Barry)
cartoonist (like Gary Larson)
Okay -- the why. The sad truth is that I chose security rather than passion (anguish upon anguish, oh what've I done!). My parents did not raise us to make decisions for ourselves. Hence my shock when Mr. Dee got in my face one day after school and said heatedly, 'Don't write what you think I want to hear! Write what YOU think! What do YOU think!' By then it was too late. I'd accepted my fate to be a dull droid, destined to design deadening drivel. Hope my boss doesn't find this website.
Gail and Larry...I can agree with you, I too gave in to the wants and dreams of others in a way that I feel affected the outcome of my life. All I wanted to do from the time I was a little boy was to play baseball. I worked hard at it and it paid off for me at the end of my senior year, when I was drafted by the San Diego Padres in the 1969 summer draft. I was also being courted by several colleges, ASU and UofA being included.
Well, I wanted to sign a contract and go off and live my dream of professional baseball, however my parents wanted me to go to college. This would put off my dream another 4 years, or possibly end my chances of going pro if something were to happen while playing at the college level. I also felt that I could always go to college down the road, and I was tired of going to school anyway.
I gave in to the desires of my parents and went to ASU, putting off what I really wanted to do...My experiences at ASU were less then desirable. Classes were hard because of the schedule we had to keep, playing ball and going to class, and as it turned out, while Bobby Winkles signed three players from Arizona, we never got to play...he basicall recruited us to keep us from attending the UofA or some other competitor...plus it looked good that he had local players on his team.
Well I got my wish my sophmore year and was drafted in the 1972 winter draft by the Mets, and got to play professional baseball, but my fears were also played out in that I had damaged my pitching arm, so my career was a short one.
I guess I have always felt that if I were to sign out of high school, that I would have had enough professional experience with a new expansion team, that I would have been able to remain in the game at some level and had a full career.
That being said, because of the route I did take, I finally met the woman of my life and have a beautiful family as a result...no complaints, I would trade my dreams for my family any time!
It's not easy to let your children make their own decisions, we never want to see our children fail at anything, however that's often how we learn. For that reason, we've always tried to be there for my kids to give advice, but we have always wanted them to think for themselves, and pursue their passions and interests. It hard to watch them stumble, make mistakes, and try to find their way, but they've all turned out to be people we can be very proud of, each pursuing directions of their own choice.
This is a deep subject, everybody... for some of us there may not be much to say and for others, a lot.
For me, my fate was decided by 2 people, my mother and my great aunt (on my dad's side). The great aunt was named Trixie, she lived in Coronado, Ca. and had beaucoup bucks. I met her the summer of 1968 when I flew to California and stayed with her for 2 weeks. She declared that she would put me through college and give me all the help I needed to become a professional woman.
My mother had other ideas. My mother was suffering from a fragile hormonal state, but none of us (including my mother) knew it at the time. My mother told Aunt Trixie that putting me through college would give me a big head, and my mother wouldn't stand for that. My mother allowed Aunt Trixie to pay for my books and tuition to ASU only. So I went to ASU (didn't want to go there, but I had no choice) and worked in Hayden LIbrary all the way through on a work-study program.
I had a very rocky time of it with my mother from about 1967 - 1974, and if I'd left in 1969, I may never have patched things up with her. I wanted to study library science9probably at UofA) and become a librarian, move away somewhere else, and then write. Well, I write anyway, and I worked in pr for many years here in Phoenix, so it's hard to say how different my life would have been if I'd gotten my way. Feeling deliberately thwarted by my mother was the bitter pill, though. That was the arrow that pierced me. Is it a regret that I didn't get an advanced degree? Well, let me say this - from all my life experiences I have at least an MBA and a couple of M.A.s, and you can probably throw in a PhD as well. The topics would be journalism, oriental medicine, marketing and advertising, true spy stories and naturopathic health.
At this very moment I am precisely who I am, what I am and where I am as a direct result of the decisions and choices I made throuout my life. To regret those decisions would be to deny that life and who I am today. That's the long view and really the only view that counts. Anything else is simply a snapshot of a particular time when I made a certain choice that may or may not have turned out good. Or maybe I did something I did not really want to do but did it anyway. Perhaps I really hurt another person. Maybe there are people breathing because of my direct intervention. In the end I will just take the Popeye approach to all this stuff........'I am what I am and that's all that I am'. The truth is I can'tdo it over and would't if I could. I like who I have turned into and needed my life to be exactly the way it was for me to feel good about who I am.
Ok I am getting way to serious with all this stuff...............Here's the deal; If I had known I was going to live this long maybe I would not have done all those drugs in the 60's. Eh....who am I kidding I probably would have done more....LOL
Thanks all who have posted so far. Now many truths come out! You are brave to share some of these rather personal chapters, and deserve our salute.
As you have said, we really do gain wisdom from our mistakes. But one different turn may not have been nirvana, after all, so we shouldn't necessarily regret that turn.
There are moments when I experience a flash of clarity, in appreciating those around me, past and present. My parents surprised the h___ out of me when they supported me unquestioningly when I made a very unpopular decision many yars ago, in fact when I was sure that they'd kick me out of their lives for it. And then some years later they did it again, bless their hearts. Those things give pause and motivate one to treat others with respect, even supporting them through sometimes ugly times. I hope that this has been true regarding my own son.
The world can use an increased measure of forgiveness, for sure.
That theme, risk or safety, believe me, runs through every life. When we lost my sister ar 35 (1992), I spoke to her three children about Mary's courage in taking the road less travelled. I likened her to a brilliant shooting star, to an eagle that soars above the rest of us who trudge with our eyes focussed downward on mundane matters. Mary turned her costuming arts talents into a hollywood career, travelled the world (directed the costuming at the Seoul Olympics ceremonies), worked impossible schedules in the West Coast theater scene, and who's to say whether all that led to her demise. We missed that young irascible Mary terribly - my Dad wept, grieved deeply, and maybe never got over losing her. She still soars, seemingly watching over us safer ones, those of us of the long trek. And her kids, all now the subject of their four uncles' pride, seem to live life fully today.
This post also implicitly asks what brings happiness. If any of us knew, well.... But it also opens a window to Socrates' 'unexamined life' exhortation. It's OK to talk about it. In fact it's demanded of us. Especially now.
Wow. To both Gary's and Jim's thoughts on this topic.
Gary, I agree with you about it taking everything that happened in my life to make me the person I am today. I, too, like the person I am today.
Good luck with your cardiac stents. You are in my prayers. I just had open heart surgery in March of this year and feel very grateful and wonderful today. I hope your blockages can be treated with stents, but if you require bypasses, it is worth the surgery. I was back to work 4 weeks after my surger; not to say it was not a lot of work to get to that point.
Jim, once again, I am in awe of your writings, in the content and the method. Thank you for sharing about your sister. I am sorry about your loss. How lucky her children are to have you in their lives. Your family seems to live their life to the fullest. I am impressed with your breadth of knowledge and experience. I always look forward to your entries on this site. Thank you!
As I got older, I decided on changing my life. So went back to UNLV in Vegas in the Summer of 1997. To get my BA in Psychology. I was in their first graduating class of 2000. I miss UNLV and was being considered for a PHD in Psychology. But did not pursue it. My Mentor was a really great guy. He wanted me to stay, but I had bought into Flagstaff.
I had been a Landscape Contractor since March 15th of 1980 in Vegas. As I moved to Flagstaff. I was going to get a job with the School District here as a Counselor.
When I started to look for a job, I got real scared at the thought of Punching a Time Clock and having so many people tell me what to do. Then the thought of why do I want to hear all these problems.
So I went for my Commercial Residential Contractors License for Arizona, and am happy still pushing a crew. My crew likes me better with my calmer approach of handling them, I have found.
When I got to Vegas to see my Daughter. I never miss a walk through UNLV. I also enjoy the scenes of UNLV on the TV Show CSI. And the TV Show Las Vegas also mentions UNLV when it was on, with James Caan.
I used to sit on the grass behind the Flashlight and Study between classes.
UNLV is a good size University. I think 5000 more Students than NAU. Between 1976 and 2000 it has gotten the Thomas Mack Auditorium and when I moved to Flagstaff they were building a new Library.
Also Howard Hughs loved UNLV to. He pledged to keep UNLV in the Newest of Computer Systems. Even to date Suma Corp replaces all the Computers every one or two years.
Gail,
As I read these posting about what might have been, it seems so easy to forget that 40 years that have past since we were making our earliest life choices. We all stand on the shoulders of many courageous, risk-taking, and successful individuals who changed the social mores and who altered the political landscape by changing legislation, initiating equity for marginalized groups of people, creating opportunities for higher education for the less elite and less financially well off (loans and grants were not readily available until the early “90s) and so much more. As we reflect on our decisions, we must also remember to reframe them in the context of the times in which we made them. For many women, especially first generation college attendees, teaching (humanities like English are included here) and nursing were the choices we saw as easily attainable……without the cultural capital of those who were mentored into less traditional professions for women like medicine (animal or human ;-), many of us simply followed the existing path into higher education. Only recently did I recognize this in my own life when it was pointed out to me that I had been essentially discriminated against in high school. During the May of our junior year, I broke my right wrist at a JCL banquet. Thus, I needed “accommodations” to complete my final exams that year. Mrs. Lamberts allowed me to dictate my Latin final, my dad typed my history paper, but when my second year Algebra teacher, (Mr. Knoche) was asked to return in June to administer the final, he refused saying that a girl doesn’t need advanced math. Technically, he was right and my parents deferred to the system. I only recently reviewed my early work and realized that my highest ACT test score was in natural science (not English)…..it was collectively overlooked. These are not things that would likely occur today given the progress we have made regarding gender equality, educational opportunity, and parental involvement.
Having said all this….I have no regrets really….as it as so eloquently been said: I am what I am! I had the best time of my life living on campus in a graduate dorm at the UA while earning my Ph.D. Something I could never have even conceived of when I was an undergrad studying English!! And this was only a few years ago….after we put our children through college!! Many women our age were trailblazers making it easier for our daughters and granddaughters (or even us) to identify their passions and follow their dreams! Our world continues to be a better place as a result. I am looking forward to cheering them on to heights we can’t even imagine.
Loretta,
I remember the night you broke your wrist. I had no idea that Mr. Knoche treated you in that manner. I think I would have been astonished if I had known. Even at that time, my thought would have been, 'How dare he.'
I can not match your elequent writing, but this was my experience. My mother was progressive in her philosophy about women. She valued higher education for women over domestic skills. I was never taught domestic skills, other than sewing. My mother started college the day I started kindergarten, so I grew up on the campus of ASU. She completed her bachelors in 3 years and then her master's degree in one year, with a 4.0 GPA. I spent many, many hours in the library, public and the ASU library. Going to college was as natural as going to high school. My mother's opinion was that every woman should have a career even if she marries. She believed every woman should have her own identity other than as wife and mother. Unfortunately my mother died when I was 20. I am forever grateful for her guidance and for my higher education. She was true to her beliefs even on her death bed. She made my father promise that he would make sure I graduated college.
Our high school and college years were a time of transition for the role of women and I am proud of my mother and her beliefs. Interesting to me and probably quite normal, I desired a life which was very different than my parents. At least I thought I did. Even though I liked my professiona role, I wanted to be a 'ranch wife' and to live with multiple generations on the same land. I did marry into that life and it drove me crazy. The reality of it was mundane and borish. This was proabably due to the 'type' of ranch family I joined. I was not accustomed to living in the old traditional gender roles, plus the expectation to continue my professional role. In retrospect I do not think my struggle was unique. It is the continual struggle to balance family and career.
I am not sure that I would have pursued nursing if my mother had not died. To echo others, I am what I am.
Loretta, I am impressed, yet, not surprised, that you are a Ph.D. I have always admired your intelligence and ethics. I am encourage to know that you just recently completed your Ph.D. I will be starting a master's program next fall. I guess we are never too old. I hope to practice as a nurse practitioner for at least 10 years.
It is wonderful to have your participation in this thread.
Thank you!
Gail,
You are quite eloquent!! and deeply authentic!
Believe it or not, my parents were quite ahead of their time...in many ways...My mother, an army nurse at the Battle of the Bulge, married at 29, but planned to go to medical school at 30 if not married....I have always said that my father (ret. Army Colonel) was the first feminist to influence me. My father cooked most of our meals, especially holidays! He didn't think his girls should clean (swab) floors...so he did. They chose to retire in Tempe so that 'if' we chose to go to college it would be affordable. My mother worked at the ASU infirmary and so it was a very familiar environment for me, too. You are so right, these are the shoulders on which we stand! My folks did what they could to encourage us....but, not being college grads themselves, they deferred to the system; not being wealthy, they provided college at $5 a semester...can you believe it? I am grateful to them for all they did and modeled....and, because of their support, I continued....on and on and on and so has my daughter. And no, it is never too late....you will enjoy school and you will bring to your program of study and to your classmates experience and knowledge that will enrich your studies and deepen your passion to be a healer. Fabulous!!
and, just a note.....the title is nice (I seldom use it though)....I did it for the neat beret Phds get to wear at convocations!! ;-)
I haven't checked this thread for about a week, and I'm really glad I did tonight.
I agree with you, Loretta. We have stood on the shoulders of those who went before us, but I doubt that any of us knew the truth of this at the time. I am glad to hear your truth and know how strong you are. I was strong, too, but my influences were different and because of them, I floundered for awhile. I eventually found my way, but positive influences were limited. One person stands out, and that is Dr. Nick Salerno. He was my ASU advisor, and I credit him with believing in me. He did when I didn't know how. My mother was so smart, but her problems got in the way of improving the lives of her daughters. I did the best I could with what I had, and I never gave up!
That is the best I can say for myself.
I am proud of all our achievements. To know that Carol Peyman is going back to school, as is Gail, and that Loretta got her PhD recently is very empowering for me. Thank you all.
I am amazed how many of us walked from THS to ASU and didn't see each other! I remember Dr. Salerno....for me the two people who were beacons were Mrs. Lamberts in highschool and Dr. Lamberts at ASU. I still use Mrs. Lamberts' 12 point grading system...and I quote Dr. JJ Lamberts in my lecture on language! They were amazing individuals and an amazing couple.
Phyllis.....it sounds like your education has been vast, varied, and without end....on your own...I think many of us floundered...I certainly did for a long time it seems. I agree that we didn't know we were the beneficiaries of others....and the young women today may be losing sight of that as well....some are very aware and continue to lead. We have been watching Mary Poppins with our granddaughter.....The mom in that movie was a suffragette...what a surprise!
As I watch all the news about how to keep one's mind from deteriorating, I believe we have the answer girls....go back to school!
Gary and Louis,
I didn't mean to gloss over your kind kudos....and, if I read your words correctly Louis, you too, returned to explore the meaning of life in psychology....and, found the meaning in Flagstaff! See the process works....congrats.
My wife got me one of those Klutz books for kids, one on watercolor, around 1992. One thing led to another, leading to an AA in art in 2004 (crammed two years into four getting it).
Somehow, though, I don't think it's over. I'm an engineer, but love working with people, especially one-on-one and in small groups (not an extravert). When I start working with someone, it's almost impossible for me to go very far without finding out something about them, married or not?, kids?, where from?, etc. Helping with the reunion has been one of the most enjoyable things I've done as an adult, and it's been unsettling to compare it to the amount of enjoyment I get from my job. So, I'm having a conversation this week with our VP of HR, who got her PhD in psychology, and who's adamant about people doing what they enjoy doing. Pending . . . .
Nick Salerno seems to have taught quite a few of us at ASU! Really enjoyed him in the classroom. Will never forget one assignment that we answer the question, 'Was Hamlet a man of action?' I took the side of no, he wasn't (of course students had to justify their answer from the text of the play). When I got the paper back he had written across the top, 'Interesting, but Wrong.....A'
Loretta,
I agree that going to school is the best way to keep our minds alert. If I keep using my mind I won't lose it. I get lost in it at times.
I am having so much fun this semester. I am taking elementary Spanish and Philosopy 101. What a kick!
I do not remember Mrs. Lambert's 12 point grading system. I sure do remember her. She was my favorite teacher of all time. I loved her smile and twinkling eyes. What did her husband teach?
This site never ceases to amaze me. My guess is that most of the topics of discussion would not likely come up at the reunion.
I was allowed to make my own decisions about what I thought I should do with my life. I always knew I would go to ASU. However, there were two major things that stood in my way. First, I lacked the study skills, and secondly, and most important, I lacked the self-discipline needed for college. So after high school graduation I enrolled at MCC for one semester. Again, the lack of self-discipline forced me to drop out and work various jobs for the next few years. I finally decided to learn a trade and went on to earn an AA degree in HVAC. For the next thirteen years I worked at ASU. It was a good job and I have no regrets. But something was missing; I wanted to do something else. I had volunteered in my son’s fourth grade class and loved it. One day my wife suggested I go back to school and earn a teaching degree. ‘But I’ll be 43 years old by the time I graduate.’ I replied. “And how old will you be if you don’t?” she said quoting Ann Landers. So I went back, this time a mature, self-disciplined student and earned a teaching degree and later a MA Ed. (Mark Rispole if you are reading this, your mother also gave me encouragement when I met with her to write my program of study at ASU. I am forever grateful.) The next fourteen years were the most rewarding years of my life, teaching 7th grade mathematics at Gililland and Connolly middle schools in TD3. I retired this past May.
Larry, you have completed many of the items on your list. You are a great artist and some of the things you write are funnier than Dave Barry. I do not know what you design but, I would guess that many of the products have made someone’s job or life easier/safer. Good luck with your “Pending…”
Gail and Carol P., good luck with your return to college. It’s fun being the old person who turns in every assignment before the due date and earns the high scores on the tests.
Jim, I always appreciate your insightful commentary. Congratulations to Loretta on your PhD. Gary T. Let us know how you are doing after your surgery.
Finally, does anyone have a positive experience to share about Mr. Knoche. I vowed that I would never treat my students the way he did.
Dr. JJ Lamberts was a professor of English; really, he was a linguist....he knew EVERYTHING, all you had to do is ask...and he could quote it in its original language....and, he didn't take it seriously!! Remember 12=A+ and so on to 1=D-.....yes, Mrs. Lamberts was my very favorite, too....they were both remarkable. I am often accused of being lost in my own thoughts...but, I remember to ask directions and then I find my way out again! And, I think philosophy may be wasted on the young...it should be fun for you now Gail (you know what I mean)....enjoy yourself.....
Larry - it sounds like you work in a company that builds on your strengths...good luck!!
Thanks, Jack, for the kind words. Really. And who knows, Loretta, there may be some dream spot in this company that I don't know about. I gotta confess that I have my doubts, but it's worth a shot. My wife's told me for years I should be a psychologist -- I've worked on enough family of origin stuff to have a double PhD in it!
I agree with Jack that this is the kind of topic we probably wouldn't get to at the reunion, no matter how much anybody had been drinking!
Jack, I admire your courage to walk away from a career and delve into something unknown, and congrats that it worked out for you! Does this mean you can teach AND fix the AC? Your wife must think of you as being the handiest guy around!
At some point in my life I began to understand the power of reinvention, and I've been doing it about every 7-10 years. I can take along my already-acquired skills, and then venture someplace new. I like new things as well as tried-and-true things. It sounds as though many of us fit this definition.
''As a Psychologist'', I have studied people going back to School in their 40's or later. There is less cases of people getting Alzheimer's and Dementia in people that have gone back to School and this includes people that do not take drugs or drink. This type of studying strengthens the Brain. But we can still get these diseases. ''Just less risk''. Reading every day helps to, but not like Studying for Exams.
I read all 27 plus Psychology Books 4 to 6 times. Spent my time on the Deans Honor Roll. I was not a 4.0 Student at UNLV, but 3.76 is still good. In 1983 I had gotten my General Studies Degree from Clark County College in Vegas, and had to work my butt off to bring that old 2.25 GPA back up to my final 3.76.
The younger Students did not like me messing up there curve {-:
I also Volunteer to set up the Achievement Center at UNLV and became the Coordinator of a large scale substance abuse project, for about a year or more.
This Winter I am going to work on getting my GRE taken, and start getting into a Master Degree Program.
Lou: Sounds like you really got your tuition's worth from your studies.....I am impressed that you extended your learning to the application in the community. That is remarkable! Grades only measure success relative to a rubric....certainly not a measure of learning! Dr. Lamberts, whom I mentioned earlier, used to say that he often declined to write a letter of rec for 4.0 students because they still had to learn a bigger lesson....that a B doesn't mean the world will collapse around you! Good luck as you prepare for the GRE....will you study Psychology? Be sure to ask 'if' there is minimum score for admittance to your program of choice....oft times there is not....just the requirement to take and submit scores (entrance score may be relative to the number of applicants). I LOVE all the new info on the recent brain research....google Marian Diamond UCBerkeley.....on youtube and listen to her introduction to her class...wonderful...she brings a brain in ....in a hatbox! I just showed two of her intros in class today....you will love what she has to say. She is one of the pioneer researchers in brain research and one of the few who were invited to take a look at Einstein's brain (after he died of course!) Gotta go read to keep up with you all.....
Geez...this is such a great conversation...so lively and interesting....it is energizing actually!
){kind=link}